Re: Jordan Davis General Discussion Thread #1

[ellejay]

--at least they didn't send word to the judge that they'd prefer dinner back at the hotel tonight, like they did yesterday.

--fingers crossed that they're close to a verdict.

John M. Phillips ‏@JohnPhillips · 13s
The jury has ordered dinner in. It won't be romantic or candle lit, but may be significant of a decision tonight. #JusticeForJordanDavis

[Cleos_mum]

JURY HAS A QUESTION.

[ellejay]

hmmmmmmmmmmm..

Q1--can we have a 30 minute break? (yes)

Q2--is it possible to reach a verdict on some counts and not on one of the counts? (yes)

[ellejay]

--as judgeH explains it, they can render their verdict on 4 counts.

--a mistrial will be declared on the 1 count they're deadlocked on, the state can then retry on that 1 count if they choose to do so.

--(sounds like they're in agreement on 4 of the counts ! excellent.)

[ellejay]

Andrew Pantazi ‏@TU_Court · 4m
Jurors are rubbing eyes. Some look on the verge of tears. #DunnTrial

[CherokeeNative]

Well - I'm banking on the jury being unable to agree on Count 1 - the 1st degree murder charge.

[Chickenbutt]

So here is what I think.......and believe me, I could be totally off....I think they have found him guilty of Murder (not sure if 1 or 2) and guilty of the gun firing charge, but can't come to a consensus on the attempted murder charges. At least I hope that is the holdup.

[CherokeeNative]

CB - you've been good at calling things before and I sure hope you are right. I would go with Murder 1 and deadlocked on attempted murder on the 3 boys to be tried again later. I just have a gut feeling that there is or are one or more white men on the jury who are being head strong wanting Dunn to walk out a free man.

[CherokeeNative]

And honestly - if I were a juror and knew that we could render a verdict on 4 and not the 1 that we had been unable to agree upon - then, I wouldn't want dinner or a break - let's get on with it and get it done with and over would be my want.

[Chickenbutt]

If he is found guilty of Murder 1, I don't think the state will retry him on the attempted murder charges. He will be in jail for life at that point. If he gets murder 2, they might retry him, but again I doubt it. If anything less than that, then I see him retrying him on those charges.
I wonder how the boys would feel if the state chose not to retry him, IF all this speculation is actually true.

[Chickenbutt]

Maybe they are so upset they need pizza to "settle their stomachs"   

[ellejay]

So here is what I think.......and believe me, I could be totally off....I think they have found him guilty of Murder (not sure if 1 or 2) and guilty of the gun firing charge, but can't come to a consensus on the attempted murder charges. At least I hope that is the holdup.

--it sounds like they have reached a verdict on four counts, cannot reach a unanimous agreement on one of the counts.


Q2—“is it possible to not reach a verdict on one count, and reach a verdict on other counts?”




Jury Question # 5.

[CherokeeNative]

If he is found guilty of Murder 1, I don't think the state will retry him on the attempted murder charges. He will be in jail for life at that point. If he gets murder 2, they might retry him, but again I doubt it. If anything less than that, then I see him retrying him on those charges.
I wonder how the boys would feel if the state chose not to retry him, IF all this speculation is actually true.

If I were one of the surviving teens, I would be pleased if he got Murder 1 and wasn't tried on the attempted charges because he would be going away forever anyway - but anything less, I would want him retried.

The worst case scenario at this point would be hung on Murder 1 count and not guilty on remaining 4 counts.

[Chickenbutt]

I thought that the judge was just using those numbers as an example. I may have mis heard tho

[CherokeeNative]

So....back to waiting.  The Judge indicated there would additional steps to take if they decide the are hung on one count and not the others.  I suppose he means that he will take measures to find out which count they are hung on and see if they can help them get past that - if they can't then, he will have to call a mistrial as to that count.

I don't know what the procedure is if they remain deadlocked - do they render the other verdicts and then try to help them with the remaining count? Or, do they try to help with the deadlocked count before rendering the verdict on the other four? Because, if they have to deal with the deadlocked count first, this will be carried on to tomorrow before we find out anything more insofar as verdicts go.

[ellejay]

I thought that the judge was just using those numbers as an example. I may have mis heard tho

--after he had read their actual question, he then went on to throw out # scenarios as examples.

--I quoted the actual Q as he read it from the jury Q to him. (Q2—“is it possible to not reach a verdict on one count, and reach a verdict on other counts?”)

[CherokeeNative]

Yes, Ellejay - I agree - the question indicates that they have reached verdicts on 4 counts but not the remaining one.

[Chickenbutt]

You are very right elle.....I re listened and they did say 1 and 4. Maybe they were just using those numbers as a example.....Now I am confusing myself.....lol
I guess we just have to wait and see

[ellejay]

So....back to waiting.  The Judge indicated there would additional steps to take if they decide the are hung on one count and not the others.  I suppose he means that he will take measures to find out which count they are hung on and see if they can help them get past that - if they can't then, he will have to call a mistrial as to that count.

I don't know what the procedure is if they remain deadlocked - do they render the other verdicts and then try to help them with the remaining count? Or, do they try to help with the deadlocked count before rendering the verdict on the other four?  Because, if they have to deal with the deadlocked count first, this will be carried on to tomorrow before we find out anything more insofar as verdicts go.

--I would think he would 1st ask them that if given additional time, would they be able to come to agreement on the deadlocked charge? if they say no, we're hopelessly deadlocked, he would then go w/ the verdict on 4 counts/declare a mistrial on the 1 count.

[CherokeeNative]

I am biased on Florida citizens - I am sorry but after what we have seen come out of that state thus far, I can't help myself.

With that said, I envision one or more good ol' boys refusing to convict Dunn for Murder under any circumstances. In fact, I would bet that it was a real fighting match to get them to convict on anything - which is why I laid out the worst case scenario above.

Sorry to be such a negative nancy

[Chickenbutt]

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] we love ya Nancy

[ellejay]

--maybe they had "too many choices" on count 1 and just can't come to a concensus between them all?

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[CherokeeNative]

So....back to waiting.  The Judge indicated there would additional steps to take if they decide the are hung on one count and not the others.  I suppose he means that he will take measures to find out which count they are hung on and see if they can help them get past that - if they can't then, he will have to call a mistrial as to that count.

I don't know what the procedure is if they remain deadlocked - do they render the other verdicts and then try to help them with the remaining count? Or, do they try to help with the deadlocked count before rendering the verdict on the other four?  Because, if they have to deal with the deadlocked count first, this will be carried on to tomorrow before we find out anything more insofar as verdicts go.

--I would think he would 1st ask them that if given additional time, would they be able to come to agreement on the deadlocked charge? if they say no, we're hopelessly deadlocked, he would then go w/ the verdict on 4 counts/declare a mistrial on the 1 count.

Yes, that is how I have seen it done in the past. I have also seen Judges say, no, I am not letting you hang this jury - go back and work some more. LOL This Judge seems to be very compassionate and easy going so I don't see him playing hard nose with the jurors. I wonder if there are guidelines that he has to go by in the Judge's Bench Book? I am sure there is case law regarding it, but I have yet to have to experience it in my dealings.

[CherokeeNative]

Ellejay - do you have a chart that tells us what the mandatory minimums are for these charges and lessers? TIA   

[ellejay]

So....back to waiting.  The Judge indicated there would additional steps to take if they decide the are hung on one count and not the others.  I suppose he means that he will take measures to find out which count they are hung on and see if they can help them get past that - if they can't then, he will have to call a mistrial as to that count.

I don't know what the procedure is if they remain deadlocked - do they render the other verdicts and then try to help them with the remaining count? Or, do they try to help with the deadlocked count before rendering the verdict on the other four?  Because, if they have to deal with the deadlocked count first, this will be carried on to tomorrow before we find out anything more insofar as verdicts go.

--I would think he would 1st ask them that if given additional time, would they be able to come to agreement on the deadlocked charge? if they say no, we're hopelessly deadlocked, he would then go w/ the verdict on 4 counts/declare a mistrial on the 1 count.

Yes, that is how I have seen it done in the past.  I have also seen Judges say, no, I am not letting you hang this jury - go back and work some more.  LOL  This Judge seems to be very compassionate and easy going so I don't see him playing hard nose with the jurors.  I wonder if there are guidelines that he has to go by in the Judge's Bench Book?  I am sure there is case law regarding it, but I have yet to have to experience it in my dealings.

--if they came in hung on ALL counts, I could see him giving the Allen charge/please work harder and try to come up with a verdict. But w/ 4 counts decided out of 5...not so much.

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